Lecture Video #4: Fate, Gods, and Man

Be sure to watch the video below (approx. 17 min) and respond to the question at the end with a COMMENT below. Also--be sure to read Books 6,9, & 12 and answer the questions in the post below. The questions are always due on your face-to-face class day (even if you don't come), but the video can be answered anytime next week. 

Reading/Questions for Homer, The Iliad, Books 6, 9, & 12

From Gareth Hinds' graphic novel, The Iliad

NOTE: Try to read Books 6-16 for next week, though these questions will only cover the first three books. I'll post a separate lecture video for Book 16, since it's longer and you might need more time to finish it. But we'll talk about all of them next week for those who come to class.

ALSO: If you're having trouble keeping some of the names straight, refer to pages 158-165 of our book, which is a GLOSSARY of the main characters in the book. It really helps the first time you encounter someone with a particularly long and exotic name like Andromache or Polypoetes. 

Answer 2 of the following:

Q1: In Book 9, Achilles makes a long and impassioned defense of his refusal to return to the war. Though Ajax is very dismissive of his answer, what do you make of it? Are we supposed to be sympathetic of Achilles here? Is this how we would respond to Agamemnon's request to return to battle? Or is he being a spoiled demigod here, using his pride and position to doom hundreds of Greek soldiers to their death? 

Q2: In Book 6, the battle stops for a short dialogue between Diomedes, the powerful Greek warrior, and Glaucus, a famous Trojan. Why is this an important encounter in displaying the beliefs and values of Greek society? Though both are warriors, what is clearly more important than winning in battle?

Q3: In Book 9, the Greek named Phoenix tells Achilles that "Prayer are daughters of great Zeus./Lame and wrinkled and with eyes averted,/They are careful to follow in Folly's footsteps,/But Folly is strong and fleet, and outruns them all,/Beating them everywhere and plaguing humans,/Who are cured by the Prayers when they come behind" (65). What is he trying to tell Achilles (and us) through this instructive metaphor? Why might this sound like the kind of advice Sappho gives in some of her poems? 

Q4: Several people in The Iliad seem to have a fatalistic approach to life, as we seen in Book 12 when Sarpedom tells Glaucus, "death is everywhere/In more shapes than we can count,/And since no mortal is immune or can escape,/Let's go forward, either to give glory/To another man or get glory from him" (74). Do you find this an optimistic or a pessimistic philosophy? If you believed this, would you be more inspired to do great deeds of heroism...or to abandon great deeds as a pointless pursuit? 

Paper #1 Assignment: The Greek Conversation

 

Like your reading questions, I’m giving you four possibilities to choose from here, but I only want you to write about ONE of them. However, I want you to give me more thought and effort than you would give in your questions. Write a 3-4 page (double spaced) response quoting from both books as support. Think about our class discussions and videos (and your previous questions) and show me the connections you see between both books. If you don't use both books in your response, or turn in a paper less than 3-4 pages, you risk getting a zero on the assignment (so be careful!). 

We'll discuss proper citation of books in class next week, as well as constructing a Works Cited page (though you should remember this, or know it, from high school and Comp 1 as well). 

CHOOSE ONE:

Q1. Which character or characters in The Iliad could have been written or created by Sappho? In other words, which ones express sentiments, ideas, or even a basic philosophy similar to Sappho’s poems? Discuss a specific passage that shows this character speaking, or acting, in a way that echoes one or more of Sappho’s fragments. Be as specific as possible so we can appreciate the connection. You might also consider whether a character takes her ideas and twists them in a new direction—maybe a more ‘masculine’ translation of Sappho.

Q2. In general, Greek culture is obsessed with immortality—not for the soul, but for the individual’s qualities/character.  As Sappho writes, “later on...in an age unlike our own/Someone will remember who we are” (87).  In The Iliad, how does the poet discuss the difference between doing glorious deeds (for one’s own immortality) and doing just/good deeds (for society’s immortality)?  Can being a hero actually be at the expense of society?  Who should a hero live and die for? 

Q3. According to Sappho and The Iliad, what is the role of the gods in human society? Sure, they’re “gods” and control the fate of the world, but how important are they really? What do they do for humanity, and what do they need from humanity? Do both works agree on this? Do they seem more reverent toward the gods, or more critical of them? You might also consider whether either work even seems to believe in the Gods. Are they the “menu” and not the “food”? (to quote from our last lecture video).

Q4. Sappho writes almost exclusively about the various forms of love (and lust) in the ancient world. Yet The Iliad is also a poem about love, since the love for a woman starts the Trojan War and every great hero (Achilles, Hector) is defined by his love for a woman. So how did the Greeks view love: as a destructive force? An ennobling force? The most beautiful thing in the world—or the most terrifying? Is their view of love basically the same as ours, or did the ancient Greeks have different views on love between men and women—and women and women?

DUE DATES:

• MONDAY CLASS: Wednesday, September 30^th by 5pm
• WEDNEDAY CLASS: Friday, October 2^nd by 5pm
• FRIDAY CLASS: Monday, October 5^th by 5pm

Schedule Changes for The Iliad

NOTE: Since the Monday classes didn't meet last week, I decided to give everyone a break and not post a lecture video this week. Just try to catch up on the reading--The Iliad, Books 1-3. The questions in the post below are due in class next week. ALSO, I changed the schedule slightly since we were a day behind. This reflects our new schedule until the paper is due, at which point we will resume the schedule on the syllabus. As you'll see, the changes are very minor.

MONDAY CLASS

M 7                  Labor Day: No Class

W 9                 Blog: Video, The Iliad, Books 1-3

F 11                 No Blog—Keep Reading!

 

M 14                Discussion: The Iliad Books 1-3

W 16               Blog: Reading/Questions for The Iliad, Books 6, 9, 12

F 18                 Blog: Video, The Iliad, Book 16

 

M 21                Discussion: The Iliad, Books 6-16

W 23               Blog: Reading/Questions for The Iliad, Books 19, 22, 23, 24

F 25                 Blog: Video, The Iliad, Books 19-24

 

M 28                Discussion: The Iliad, Books 19-24

W 30               Paper #1 due by 5pm

 

WEDNESDAY CLASS

M 7                  Blog: Greek Mythology, etc.

W 9                 In-Class Discussion: The Iliad, Book 1

F 11                 Blog: Reading/Questions for The Iliad, Books 1-3

 

M 14                [No Blog: Keep Reading!]

W 16               Discussion: The Iliad, Books 1-3

F 18                 Blog: Reading/Questions for The Iliad, Books 6,9,12

 

M 21                Blog: Video, The Iliad Books 16

W 23               Discussion: The Iliad, Books 6-16

F 25                 Blog: Reading/Questions for The Iliad, Books 19, 22, 23, 24

 

M 28                Blog: Video, The Iliad, Books 19-24

W 30               Discussion: The Iliad, Books 19-24

F 2                   Paper #1 due by 5pm

 

FRIDAY CLASS

F 4                   In-Class Discussion for The Iliad, Book 1

 

M 14                Blog: Reading/Questions for The Iliad, Books 1-3

W 16               [No Blog: Keep Reading!]

F 18                 In-Class Discussion for Sappho, The Iliad, Books 1-3

 

M 21                Blog: Reading/Questions for The Iliad, Books 6,9,12 

 

W 23               Blog: Video, The Iliad, Books 16

F 25                 In-Class Discussion for The Iliad, Books 6-16

 

M 28                Blog: Reading/Questions for The Iliad, Books 19, 22, 23, 24

W 30               Blog: Video, The Iliad, Books 19-24

F 2                   In-Class Discussion for The Iliad, Books 19-24

 

OCTOBER

M 5                  Paper #1 due by 5pm

 

 

 

Reading/Questions for Homer, The Iliad, Books 1-3

NOTE: Friday's class should do the posts below this one first. This will be for next week (the week of the 14th).

Answer two of the following:

Q1: From the first three books, what kind of relationship do humans have with the gods? What role do the gods serve for them, and likewise, what roles do humans serve for the gods?  What makes this relationship so different from the man/God relationship in most monotheistic religions (Christianity, Judaism, Islam)? 

Q2: Examine Achilles’ confrontation with Agamemnon in Book I: how do we respond to him as a hero in this passage?  Does he seem modern and sympathetic here, or is he petulant and childish?  Do you think Homer’s audience would have felt the same (or is it just how we see it)?

Q3: Though Achilles is often thought to be the embodiment of hubris (excessive pride, overconfidence, etc.), in what ways does Agamemnon also deserve this title?  How do we see the leader of the Greek armies display this quality, and how does it endanger the Greeks’ relationship with the gods?

Q4: In Book 3, Helen confronts Aphrodite and tells her, “It would be treason to share [Paris’] bed” (41). Why is she so disgusted by Paris and defiant toward Aphrodite? Do you think this is how Sappho would have envisioned or characterized Helen? Why or why not?

Lecture Video #3: Greek Mythology and The Iliad

NOTE: Be sure to read Book 1 (chapter 1) of The Essential Iliad for next week. For Wednesday and Friday classes, we'll talk about Book 1 in class, but mostly I'll try to tell you some things to notice and look out for. Later next week, I'll post the first reading questions for the later chapters--so feel free to read ahead.

ALSO: I buried the response question in the video itself, so please watch the video so you know what to respond to. Then write your response as a COMMENT below, or e-mail it to me. (I notice some people aren't watching the videos, so be careful--they will help you with the readings!) 

Last Questions for Sappho's Poems

* You don't have to comment on the blog for this assignment--it's like your normal 4 questions, but I only gave you one. You can bring this to class with you or e-mail it to me instead if you like. 

NOTE: Be sure to get our next book, The Essential Iliad, since we'll start reading that next week. I'll post a video soon to introduce you to the world of Greek gods/mythology that the work is set in.

READ THE POEMS FROM PAGES 189-355 (most are just a line long)

ONLY ONE QUESTION THIS TIME!

Q1: Most of the poems in this part of the book are very fragmentary, and some are only a few words. We don't really know if all of these are distinct poems, or actually belong to each other. Indeed, some of these poems might all be part of one 'lost' poem, just in different versions. So choose 4-5 "tiny" poems that you think would work together as a larger poem. Write that poem out and explain why you think these lines work well together and help us 'see' a larger poem or story. 

FOR EXAMPLE, here's mine:

I conversed with you in a dream Kyrpogeneia (134)

and gold chickpeas were growing on the banks (143)

mingled with all kinds of colors (152)

my darling one (163),

someone will remember us, I say, even in another time (147)

I chose these lines because they paint a picture of a dream-world where the poet and her lover live together in happiness, by the bank of a river with gold chickpeas growing, full of all kinds of colors. It's a memory of happier times when they weren't far apart. And she the poet tells her that even though they're apart and forgotten today, someone will one day remember their love, maybe thousands of years later, when they read about it in a poem. Just like we are today! :) 

See? Wasn't that fun? Now try to make your own!